Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Greetings to all!

I have made one more experiment / updating of mechanics/. This updating facilitates game of high notes. It is established on my old bassoon which I use for carrying out of experiments.

Before this updating I could play on this bassoon only high Re#:
                                                          http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=0gOG6iPFvu8
Here you can see the first test:
                                                         http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=-CApmU-f1ls

I wish to add, that all it is made on a terrace of my small apartment. I have no necessary materials and equipment to make a final variant of my mechanics. I completely not rich person and I should be engaged in another matters to earn for a life.
Therefore for my experiments there is not enough time and means. The final variant of a bassoon with my mechanics can be made at factory or a specialized workshop where there is all necessary for this purpose.

The bassoon is my favourite musical instrument. And I try to improve mechanics of a bassoon to facilitate play to all bassoonists.

Thanks.
Mikhail.

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Hello Mikhail, again.

Thanks for the update. However neither of these links show us how it works, so no one is going to believe that you've accomplished what you claim until we see how your system really works, meaning if there are any new tone holes & keys, what linkages do what, if the entire range of the bassoon is still obtainable, etc.

If you're concerned about some one else doing exactly what you've acheived, then don't post here again until you've patented your developments and would be in a position to claim infringement against any outside party.

If you're not concerned about this, and/or any business or marketing matters, then if you want us to believe in your modifications, then you need to explain everything in detail.

With all respect.

Harry Searing
Bassoon, Contrabassoon, Heckelphone
Faculty: Manhattan School of Music Precollege Division (NY), Montclair State University (NJ) &  CUNY (NY)
President, LRQ Publishing - featuring the bassoon music of Francisco Mignone

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

For Mr.Harry Searing and for those from whose name it here has written the answer.
I from anybody demand nothing also to anybody nothing should.
Here I show some results of my research work .
If my work irritates someone or causes negative emotions these people can not look at it.

I think, that there is a problem of difficult transitions on a bassoon, and also a problem of high notes.
I here show, that problems can be eliminated. Look video:   

                              http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=kMzdHvnI53Q

Here I use a usual old cane / a reed/. On a bassoon I play very seldom as I have no time for this purpose.

Whom my research work interests, please, write to me on a E-mail:  komist2@gmail.com

Mikhail

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Hello!
Many bassoonists ask me: Why manufacturers of bassoons (factorys) do not produce the modified bassoons with additional opportunities? I think, that this question is better for setting to manufacturers of a bassoon.

I can tell that all known factories of bassoons have the information on my experiments. In the beginning manufacturers of bassoons showed the big interest, but when I have written to them, that I would like to get small indemnification for my work, there came silence. Probably manufacturers of bassoons consider, that my work costs $0.00.

But despite of everything, I wish to continue my work and to make a final variant of the modified bassoon.

I already wrote, that I not rich person and have no many materials and necessary parts (screws, racks for keys and so on). Probably there are people who can help to me for further my work. I with gratitude shall accept any help. Thanks.

Write to me on a E-mail:komist2@gmail.com

Thanks. Mikhail.

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Hello!

Please, answermr to two questions.
1. can you play these notes on your bassoon?

http://www.compartimos.net/fagot/nuevo-mecanismo-de-fagot-vt7.html

http://img182.imageshack.us/my.php?image=notasdc2.png
http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=kMzdHvnI53Q

Yes/No

2. would you like have a bassoon on which you could to play these notes?

Yes/No

Thanks. Mikhail

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

I can play up to high G with the right reed.  I can even just play the note standing alone, so not just slurring up to it.  I know a fingering for high Ab that works but it's just a silly parlor trick.  Quite honestly, I think that it should stay a silly parlor trick.

For an instrument that already had 4 1/2 octave range, the largest standard range in the woodwind family, I think we can keep the composers at bay from writing above the treble clef staff for a tenor/bass instrument.  So no, I don't care to have those notes.

I do think it's commendable the work that you are doing, but I just don't see a place for it in the normal bassoon world.  It's a great "proof of concept" though.

M.M.A., D.M.A. University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign: B.Mus. Lawrence University
Bassoon professor at University of Wisconsin Eau-Claire
Maker of the Little-Jake electric bassoon pickup and Weasel bassoon reeds

Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Largeness of the bassoon has 3,5 octaves and, it has not 4,5!!
There are pieces for bassoon that have high notes. I think that it is not correct to prohibit the composers to put high notes...
Also you can say that they should not put difficult tonalities, rapid tempo, ect...
It would be much more reasonable to use my system and to touch high notes without problems.
Merry Christmas
Mikhail

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Another year has passed. Some bassoonist trying to play a high note ......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pv7is51CBt8&watch_response

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M_ojdJgRuQ&watch_response

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pdddb7kbWEA&watch_response

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8J22g7hzjcg&feature=related

but nobody wants to use the additional keys ..... very strange people ....

Happy New Year 2009!

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Here's another .... Iron labial apparatus ..... and if he used the extra keys  ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHHLQ3ZYgE&watch_response

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Greetings to all!


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

photo 1)

On photo - 2 extra key C#, D# . Clicking on the extra key C# is closed C and opens to C#. Clicking on the extra key D# is closed D and  opened D#

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

Photos N8 of additional key D. This flap is easy to play a trill to  C- D , as well as tremolo Bb - D , B - D .......and if the bassoon are additional valves C# , D# - easy to play trills  C# - D , D - D# ..  thumb left hand....

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

New version of extra keys ... See Photos N8 and N9


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

A few more photos.  Aditional key C  ....
See Photos N10 and N11


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

How to work extra keys?
  1) Additional key C has a connection with keys C and D. Click on the extra key C , and the closing sound holes C and  D
  2) Additional keyC# has a connection with keys C, D and C#
Click on the extra key C#, and the closing sound holes C and D, open a sound hole C#.
  3) Additional key Eb has a connection with the D and Eb keys.
Click on the extra key Eb, closing sound hole D and simultaneously opens the sound hole Eb.
  4) Additional key D has a connection with key D ....

See Photos N10 and N11


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

New version of extra keys D, C  ... See Photos N12


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Extra keys.....Photo N 13

http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

Last edited by mikhail (2009-05-24 09:08:00)

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

OK, I'm game, what do these new keys on the wing joint do? There's the key above the high D key that seems to have a connection to the C-sharp key. And then there's three new keys a top the whisper key, C-sharp and high A.

Harry Searing
Bassoon, Contrabassoon, Heckelphone
Faculty: Manhattan School of Music Precollege Division (NY), Montclair State University (NJ) &  CUNY (NY)
President, LRQ Publishing - featuring the bassoon music of Francisco Mignone

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

My lord, don't we already have enough left thumb keys?

Harry, my guess is those keys are used for notes above the treble clef staff.  And probably some automatic mechanisms for going around high B through D or something.

M.M.A., D.M.A. University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign: B.Mus. Lawrence University
Bassoon professor at University of Wisconsin Eau-Claire
Maker of the Little-Jake electric bassoon pickup and Weasel bassoon reeds

Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Trent, he hasn't run out of solder yet! How about some foot mechanisms? That might be fun!

Harry Searing
Bassoon, Contrabassoon, Heckelphone
Faculty: Manhattan School of Music Precollege Division (NY), Montclair State University (NJ) &  CUNY (NY)
President, LRQ Publishing - featuring the bassoon music of Francisco Mignone

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

DaHah wrote:

Trent, he hasn't run out of solder yet! How about some foot mechanisms? That might be fun!

Have you seen my blog?

Running my bassoon into this:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3172/3488527325_e69b31858f.jpg

Lots of tap dancing.


So I guess I shouldn't talk....

M.M.A., D.M.A. University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign: B.Mus. Lawrence University
Bassoon professor at University of Wisconsin Eau-Claire
Maker of the Little-Jake electric bassoon pickup and Weasel bassoon reeds

Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

**The dogs bark but the caravan continues.**



I continue to work ...


See Photos N14


http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

I propose to revert to a triple system.

Terry B. Ewell wrote:


So this is my reply. I think the concept of a single key to articulate FA# (F# or Gb) SOL# (G# or Ab) and LA# (A# or Bb) has many advantages, particularly below F4 (the F above open F). However, I can think of some issues with higher notes. For instance, what if you have a high note fingering in which you want to depress the LA# (Bb key) and the SOL# (Ab key)? My understanding of this system is that this will not be possible.

More esoteric fingerings may not be possible such as certain multiphonics.

So Mikhail's system appears to work well for 95% of the the bassoon repertoire, but will present new problems for the remaining (and rarer) repertoire.

See photo 14. http://fotos.hispavista.com/fagot

Keys Bb and F# are in their places. Features a universal key is another key ... what you say about this?

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48

Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

I feel sort of like a philistine asking this, but I'm totally lost when I take a look at the thirteenth picture on that website:
http://fotos.hispavista.com/presentacionAlbum/visualizarFoto/index.phtml?idFoto=568012&nombreAlbum=fagot&orden=
Do you think you could put some captions on it or something to make it clearer as to which keys are which?
Thanks much
YoT

Brass bands are all very well in their place - outdoors and several miles away. ~Thomas Beecham

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

Hi!
I recommend everyone to visit this interesting web site:
http://www.contrabassoon.org/contrabassoonists.htm
There are many informations about the contrabassoon
see you soon!

_______________________
Ulrich Teich
President Fan Club Raimondo Inconis
Germany

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Re: new triple automatic system for the keys fa# , sol# , la#.

mikhail wrote:

Here's another .... Iron labial apparatus ..... and if he used the extra keys  ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYHHLQ3ZYgE&watch_response

Oh! It 's look like good.