Topic: More on migration

Some members have raised questions as to why IDRS decided to migrate to the Forum. The president of IDRS, Nancy Ambrose King, posted to the list an overview and reasons for this change. The following is additional information that I hope will help members further understand the decision to migrate to the Forum.

First, I need to make clear that I created IDRS OnLine, and for the past 11 years, I have personally invested a considerable amount of time and effort in building the list. I have no intention, as some of you have dramatically stated, to “destroy the community.” I have invested too much time and effort to build it. I along with the board believe that the Forum is the next step in the evolution of IDRS OnLine. Nothing has been taken away from current IDRS OnLine subscribers. The Forum changes the method by which members post and read messages. IDRS OnLine will remain, but will be open only for IDRS official communication.

The size and the scope of the list have reached practical limits. Technically a list can have unlimited size and scope. Practically, the list of 1829 members, with the amount of activity on IDRS OnLine, is unusually large by list standards. Last spring, for the first time in the 10-year history of IDRS OnLine, the list had a catastrophic breakdown. I asked the University ITS for assistance. They assigned one poor graduate student who had to go through every subscriber to find flaws with their entries. I know that the detective work took numerous tedious hours to complete. ITS told me to break the list down into two smaller lists (typical solution from ITS) to avoid problems in the future. Imagine the controversy this could have created!

There are many subscribers to the list who have decided to stop receiving messages from the list (postpone). These members found the list informative, but they were simply overwhelmed with the flood of messages they were receiving from the list. Just ask Norma Hooks. Both of us receive regularly numerous pleas from subscribers begging to get them off the list. Obviously, they have not expressed their opinions regarding the migration, since they are not receiving any messages from the list.

As stated by Nancy Ambrose King, IDRS is thriving. The society in its mid year and it has 4000+ members worldwide. Currently, 1829 people, or 45% of members, are subscribed to the list. I anticipate that subscriptions to the list will continue to increase. Something had to be done to meet the needs of future subscribers. The most sensible solution that I could find was the Forum.

After members iron out the glitches and bumps of the initial learning curve of the Forum, I know that they will find the Forum to be friendly, intuitive, informative and enjoyable to use.


Sincerely,

Yoshi Ishikawa
Professor of Bassoon, U of Colorado at Boulder
Editor, IDRS OnLine Publications
Administrator, IDRS Forum

Re: More on migration

Many will likely migrate to the doublereed list at woodwind.org (which elicits no dues to grant access) rather than use a medium which does not meet their needs since their pleas are meeting a stone wall.

Rich Gordley

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Re: More on migration

Doublereed.org indeed solicits for donations, $50 I believe. It sell ads and charges for web hosting. Its interest is truly commercial. As more people use their site, the organization makes more money.

Yoshi Ishikawa
Professor of Bassoon, University of Colorado at Boulder, College of Music
Editor, IDRS OnLine Publications

Re: More on migration

To join the IDRS forum you MUST pay dues.  To join doublereed.org you MAY wish to contribute. People who for whom payment is not an option wish to have some say in the administration of their organization.  People for whom payment is NOT mandatory are seemingly getting a better deal.  Truth - you can't deny it, you can only rationalize it.

Rich Gordley

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Re: More on migration

I agree, you can rationalize anything including a membership to...

Yoshi Ishikawa
Professor of Bassoon, University of Colorado at Boulder, College of Music
Editor, IDRS OnLine Publications

Re: More on migration

I feel the benefits of IDRS far outweigh the cost.  I find the printed Journal, alone, invaluable.  I agree that the initial communications regarding the change from listserv to forum were not the best.  However, one cannot deny that Professor Ishikawa has made a tremendous effort in making access changes, answering complaints, and the addition of the chatroom can give the site a great community feel.  The resources available at this site are truly unparalleled.  As one who voiced concern on the listserv, I feel my comments were responded to (definately no stone wall for me). I am a participant in the woodwind.org list and I enjoy the interactions there, but this is an entirely different place.  I wouldn't trade it for anything.

Steve Welgoss
Long Island, NY
bassoon@welgoss.com

Re: More on migration

Agreed the Journal is great.  That doesn't mean that everything is great.  There is always room for improvement. Decisions that are imposed rather than arrived at by consensus are going to stir up controversy especially when there is a history of perceived heavy handedness in the administration of the list.  (Some of us still feel that no reasonable explanation was given in the Herb Fawcett brouhaha.)  Trying to cover the technological shortcomings of the forum by insinuating that members don't know how to properly operate their computer, misreprenting the requirements for usage of other doublereed resources, and trying to misrepresent the arguments of the opposition as ad hominem do not help the position.

There is no doubt that Yoshi has done yeoman duty on both the list and the forum.  I don't see that as an argument to remove one of the benefits of IDRS membership.  To paraphrase what they say in the investment business, past performance shouldn't be an excuse to curtail services.

Now that the decision to lay the list to rest has been made, an appeal has been made for help with maintenance of the forum.  Why was no appeal to the membership for additional funds, additional help, additional feedback made before the decision to deep six the list?

Springing things on people with no warning and presenting the appearance that no matter what the membership wants, the wishes of the few are going to prevail, is (in my opinion) not the way this should have been done.  Do I think my opinion is going to matter?  Not at all.  My $50 a year gets me what the powers that be decide is good for me. I realize that.

Rich Gordley

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Re: More on migration

Okay, now that I've figured this out, I think the forum works just fine for me. It may, in fact, save a bit 'o time. :-)

Regarding the chatroom (Chatbox): Yoshi, is there any way to let us know there are people in the room? I've been on other sites where it will say "five people in the room" or some such thing. It was sort of helpful. I'm not sure if that can be added, but it's "just an idea and you can ignore it if you want" (to quote my mother who has handed down her insecurities to her second daughter!).

So I will have to eat my doubtful words about the forum, I believe. I'm willing to do that. (They aren't fattening anyway.)

PEM
http://www.oboeinsight.com
AIM: Patioboe

Re: More on migration

I think that most of the opposition is just a resistance to change. As soon as they try it out and have the patience to learn how the system works, the comments will cut down.

I personally enjoy the Forum.

Claire Binkley
Oboe/English Horn
West Chester University